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October 31, 2006

Comments

Dickeylee

We had got rid of these welfare payments in the 90's. But the powerful farm lobby got them re-instated. The biggest welfare queens are now our farmers. Nobody had a problem of outsourcing steel (and steelworker's jobs), auto production, the electronic industry (remember the Zenith plant in Springfield), and on and on and on. We can get cheaper foods from Chile. Brazil, Argentina, Canada, etc...make the farmer compete along with the rest of us.
America's welfare queens now drive their F-350 dually down to the Ag office to pick up their check.

Not Red

Interesting point dickey, and very true.

And These Welfare Queens are OVERWHELMINGLY Republican and call themselves "conservative".

Red States are predominantly rural, and red states take more from the government than they give in taxes. Thus the term "Red Welfare States".

A big probllem with so-called conservatives is that they often don't know what that term means, and call themselves conservative when they are NOT and call Bush conservative, when even Wm. F. Buckley, JR the guy who should know a thing or two, SAYS he's NO conservative.

Red State IDIOT Welfare Queens.

craig

I challenge anybody that would call a farmer a welfare queen to go work on a farm for a month. When you are done (if you make it) then you can come back and post (you won't have time while you are there) about how easy it is to work 18 hour days of hard labor just because of you love of the land.

Not Working

oh, puleeze, we're talking about:
"government pay(ing) farmers not to grow certain crops".

I'd like to be paid for 18 hour days of NOT working that land.

Besides, we're NOT talking cattle farmers, here, some hard workin' folks, them, but the air-conditioned million-$ combine riding, 2,000-plus acres peeps.

I HAVE worked on a farm, craigy, and i DO hate the gov handouts those guys get in land fallow programs, market price supports and tax writeoffs.

So maybe "Welfare KINGS" is a better term. More manly...

craig

Now I do disagree with the government paying not to grow crops. I do remember that it was stupid in the 90's and it is stupid now. What would be wrong with instead of leaving that land dormant, growing something that you could make ethanol out of? My suggestion would be to do anything possible to become energy independent, and part of that is growing more crops that can be converted to fuel.
And if you have a problem with the policy, attacking the people that benifit from the policy doesn't do anything but make you look stupid.

If these payments to "farmers" were only going to family farmers that would be one thing. But the big corporate agri giants are getting them too.

Not Rush

Actually, attacking those that benefit from welfare is exactly where we GET the term "Welfare Queen", genius.

Rush Limbaugh used it to embarrass the Moms that had sixteen kids just to get over on the system. Remember? So, again, don't blame ME for lowering the tenor of the debate. The so-called conservatives did that more than a decade ago.

You just never thought that you and yours would be labelled that SAME way did you? Well, we city folks may see thing differently and can turn it back against those that created the term.

craig

So now Rush is your hero? If it makes you feel better to resort to that, then so be it. But like I said it makes you look stupid.
And no, I don't remember what terms Rush used, since I don't listen to him.

And anon @8:25,
Thanks for bringing something intelligent to the table.

Not Smart

So, craig, how stupid is it to DEFEND those people that BENEFIT from a policy you DON'T support?

THAT is the crux of Republican Conservatism. "I don't support gub'mint handouts, unless they're for MY family."

Not Able To Grasp

"Rush is your hero"?

Yeah, THAT'S what I was saying. Boy, you have a flair for the bass ackward, dont'cha?

And you're worried about ME "looking stupid"?

And These Welfare Queens are OVERWHELMINGLY Republican and call themselves "conservative".

Now thats comical....liberals claiming now their compasion for welfare is to help conservatives??? Get real.

Not That Compassionate...

"liberals claiming now their compasion for welfare is to help conservatives???"

Oh, yeah, THAT'S what I was saying. Wow.

No, it's that: "Conservatives are hypocrits, throwing terms around like Welfare Queens, but give even more defecit-creating welfare to Big Corporations, like Big Farm, Big Pharm, Big Oil, Big War."

Clear enough for ya? No compassion here for conservatives.

craig

You are the one quoting Rush, and admittedly using his tactics. Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.
And lumping together everyone that benifits from a government program into one group and accusing them of fraud and abuse is stupid and closed minded. There are plenty of usefull social programs out there that need to be tweeked to avoid the abuse that goes on, but you shouldn't lump all people together (otherwise known as labeling).

Not Able to Keep a Straight Face.

"accusing them of fraud and abuse is stupid and closed minded"

GOP Tactic #210: "When you can't argue the issues you make stuff up"

Nope, never MENTIONED fraud, etc. but thanks for playing.

Rush is actually YOUR hero and the voice of The Right, even if you claim you don't listen, your talking points show the nut doesn't fall far from the tree. Ever hear of Fight Fire With Fire?

Centrist Liberals are known for being reasonable and cogent. Right Wingers are known for being jingoistic, moralistic, (as opposed to being actually MORAL), and simplistic. Oh, and they LIE.

craig

"Centrist Liberals are known for being reasonable and cogent."
Then could you go an find one so I can have a reasonable discussion?

Not Bot

Well, actually i had to point out the history of the remark, because with most issues, craigy, you have NO CLUE.

No Idea about history, what went before, who said what or who did what. Politics IS about history. "Those who don't know their history are destined to repeat it". You show your ignorance of conservative values, of consevative tactics and of the actual state of the art of political discourse.

So with no where to take it mentally, you conclude Rush is my hero and I use his tactics as a prop to the man.

It doesn't surprise me you can't see that you have to talk to the levels of your audience, but it's clear that even Rush is a couple levels above what you're dealing with.

Not Reasonable

craig:"Then could you go an find one so I can have a reasonable discussion?"

Like: "I'm against welfare but not the people benefiting from it"?

That's your reasonable?

craig

Like: "I'm against welfare but not the people benefiting from it"?

When did I say that?
Pay attention, I said that social programs are usefull they just need to be tweeked to root out the abuse.

And it is obvious that you don't agree with Rush's stances on issues, but you must at least admire the tactics he uses, since you use the same tactics.

Dickeylee

Hey Craig, try

http://www.ewg.org/farm/

There you can dial up any State, county, and farm and see what and how mush welfare each individual farm and farmer has received.
How about your friends and neighbors in Odessa, Mo? Try Tilly Farms, $850,889 in the last 9 years, or how about Varner Brothers, $913,457 in the last 9 years, $85K in 2004. How about Moore Farms, $663,245, or hey, look at Mahnken Farms, a whopping $976,976 since 1995.
They're hard working all right, hard working the welfare lines at the Ag office filling our more welfare forms.
But don't take my word for it, try the web site!

Dickeylee

Sorry, but I forgot to say that these records are for 1995-2004, which is a ten year timeframe, my bad. Mush mush.

I wouldn't call it welfare. It is a way to keep too much of any commody off the open market which would drive the price to such a low level that most small farmers would lose their ability to compete and be driven out of business. In the end, we would end up buying bread from china. Does anyone think that is a good idea?

Rush is actually YOUR hero and the voice of The Right Under that strategy us on the right would be quoting Al Franken yet I fail to see that anytime in these posts. Just admit it you idolized Rush.

but give even more defecit-creating welfare to Big Corporations, like Big Farm, Big Pharm, Big Oil, Big War."

Theirs Claire's strategy on getting elected Big Non-Profit

Rush limbaugh is a drug addicted blow hard.

Rush limbaugh is a drug addicted blow hard.

Then why do you pay so much attention to him?

Dickeylee

9:52, please stop with the fairy tales. Farming has gone corporate. There are some "small" livestock operations out there, but row crop farming has gone BIG in the last 15-20 years. Only way to afford those $100K tractors, seed drills, harvesters, etc...So if buying bread from China is bad, how about Canada?

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